May 29, 2026

Devin Townsend "The Moth is about the journey—but it is also about arrival” – PipemanRadio Interview

iHeartRadio podcast player badge
Amazon Music podcast player badge
Audible podcast player badge
Spotify podcast player badge
Pandora podcast player badge
Apple Podcasts podcast player badge
Spreaker podcast player badge
Overcast podcast player badge
Castro podcast player badge
PocketCasts podcast player badge
Podchaser podcast player badge
Deezer podcast player badge
Podcast Addict podcast player badge
RSS Feed podcast player badge
iHeartRadio podcast player iconAmazon Music podcast player iconAudible podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconPandora podcast player iconApple Podcasts podcast player iconSpreaker podcast player iconOvercast podcast player iconCastro podcast player iconPocketCasts podcast player iconPodchaser podcast player iconDeezer podcast player iconPodcast Addict podcast player iconRSS Feed podcast player icon

Devin Townsend goes all out on new double-single ‘Prepare For War / The Big Snit’ Taken from ambitious, orchestral-metal opus The Moth

The Moth is about the journey—but it is also about arrival”

Canadian metal maverick Devin Townsend recently announced the long-awaited release of his ambitious, orchestral-metal opus ‘The Moth’, out 29th May 2026 via InsideOutMusic.

An album over a decade in the making, it existed in the back of Devin Townsend’s mind as his “life’s work”. Then, about six years ago, after an acoustic show in Amsterdam, Townsend was approached by the head of the North Netherlands’ Orchestra and Choir with an offer; and with that moment The Moth stopped being an idea and began to become a reality.

Today he is pleased to reveal another part of The Moth narrative in the shape of the visceral and heavy double-single ‘Prepare For War / The Big Snit’. Watch the video, directed by Studio Sparks, here: https://youtu.be/wdhwXKtVBR0

Devin comments: “This is a track that essentially acts as a ‘soundtrack for an unmade movie’ …if you think of it as a ‘song’ it’s not really going to work, but if you think of it as a cinematic ‘experience’ that is representative of the final moments before a ‘fundamental change’, it’s a cool adventure.

The name ‘The Big Snit’ was taken from a short cartoon from the Canadian national film board by the same name I grew up with. If you get a chance, look it up on YouTube … I guess my version here is simply a kind of heavy metal version of that :)”

Stream the single here: https://dvn.lnk.to/PrepareForWarTheBigSnit

If The Moth has a central gravitational theme, Townsend names it plainly: true self-acceptance. Something sturdier than slogans, closer to a practiced willingness to face what is uncomfortable without turning away. As Devin explains: “The most obvious metaphor for change within the concept of this project was a moth: from caterpillar to an entirely different creature—one so drawn to the light that it burns itself away. What remains is immutable—only the spirit.”

At the hardest moments, when abandoning the project might have seemed rational, Townsend points to the team as the decisive factor. A host of incredible musicians and contributors participated throughout the course of this process, as well as the North Netherlands Orchestra & Choir and orchestrators Joseph Stevenson & Niels Bye Nielsen. Long time band members Darby Todd, Mike Keneally, James Leach played a huge part, as well as guests including the Steve Vai, Anneke van Giersbergen, Lynn Wu (Ou), and artists Travis Smith & Eliran Kantor, plus key creative consultation from Mike St-Jean. The technical teams that worked tirelessly included co-mixer Chris Edrich, recording engineers Ben Searles & Jacob Hermann, Atmos mixer Ron Searles, Mastering engineer Troy Glessner, choirs in various countries throughout the world, and peripheral individuals that helped land this behemoth of a plane.

DEVIN TOWNSEND online:
https://www.hevydevy.com
https://www.facebook.com/dvntownsend
https://www.omerch.com
https://www.patreon.com/cw/DevinTownsend
https://twitter.com/dvntownsend
https://www.instagram.com/dvntownsend/
https://www.tiktok.com/@dvntownsend
https://www.youtube.com/user/poopynuggeteer/featured
https://twitch.tv/devin_townsend

Click Here to Subscribe to The Adventures of Pipeman for PERKS, BONUS Content & FREE GIVEWAYS!

Take some zany and serious journeys with The Pipeman aka Dean K. Piper, CST on The Adventures of Pipeman also known as Pipeman Radio syndicated globally “Where Who Knows And Anything Goes.”
Would you like to be a sponsor of the show?
Would you like to have your business, products, services, merch, programs, books, music or any other professional or artistic endeavors promoted on the show?
Would you like to be interviewed as a professional or music guest on The Adventures of Pipeman, Positively Pipeman and/or Pipeman in the Pit?
Would you like to host your own Radio Show, Streaming TV Show, or Podcast?

PipemanRadio Podcasts are heard on Pipeman Radio, Talk 4 Media, iHeartRadio, Pandora, Amazon Music, Audible, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and over 100 other podcast outlets where you listen to Podcasts.

The following are the different podcasts to Follow, Listen, Download, Subscribe:

  • The Adventures of Pipeman
  • Pipeman Radio
  • Pipeman in the Pit – Music Interviews & Festivals
  • Pipeman – The Wandering Jew
  • Positively Pipeman – Empowerment, Inspiration, Motivation, Self-Help, Business, Spiritual & Health & Wellness


Click Here to Subscribe for PERKS, BONUS Content & FREE GIVEWAYS!

Follow @pipemanradio on all socials & Pipeman Radio Requests & Info at www.linktr.ee/pipemanradio

Stream The Adventures of Pipeman daily & live Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays at 1PM ET on W4CY Radio & Talk 4 TV.

Download, Rate & Review the Podcast at The Adventures of Pipeman, Pipeman Radio, Talk 4 Media, iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, YouTube & All Podcast Apps.
WEBVTT

1
00:00:04.639 --> 00:00:12.519
Hi, you love don too censure wow for you young.

2
00:00:19.600 --> 00:00:21.839
This is the Pipe Man here on the Invention's Pipe

3
00:00:21.839 --> 00:00:25.800
Man W four c Y Radio. And I'm very excited

4
00:00:25.839 --> 00:00:28.719
about our next guest because there is music dropping tomorrow

5
00:00:28.879 --> 00:00:31.719
that is like so badass I can't even believe it.

6
00:00:32.280 --> 00:00:34.759
So let's welcome to the show, Devin Townsend. Now are you.

7
00:00:35.159 --> 00:00:36.960
I'm good, buddy, Thank you for having me on.

8
00:00:37.520 --> 00:00:40.719
Oh My Pleasure, or as you're probably better known as

9
00:00:41.479 --> 00:00:47.880
pissy pants.

10
00:00:44.719 --> 00:00:48.039
Man mayor of Groovytown. I love it. I love it.

11
00:00:48.200 --> 00:00:51.240
Not a title that that one should sniff that man,

12
00:00:51.320 --> 00:00:53.920
it takes a while to to reach that echelon.

13
00:00:54.679 --> 00:00:55.759
That's right, that's right.

14
00:00:56.240 --> 00:00:59.399
So I gotta tell you, I was listening to the

15
00:00:59.439 --> 00:01:03.479
new album Them, you know before it comes out, and

16
00:01:04.560 --> 00:01:06.799
oh my god, I felt like I was in a

17
00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:10.480
heavy metal, pink Floyd cinematic movie.

18
00:01:11.120 --> 00:01:15.959
Yeah, yeah, man, I think I think the objective for

19
00:01:16.519 --> 00:01:19.239
the Moth was essentially like like sort of like an

20
00:01:19.280 --> 00:01:21.640
audio cinema. That it's like we're trying to make a

21
00:01:22.239 --> 00:01:24.680
soundtrack for a movie that doesn't exist, I guess in

22
00:01:24.719 --> 00:01:27.840
a sense. So I appreciate the acknowledgment of that. Man.

23
00:01:28.400 --> 00:01:32.719
Well, you know, It's funny because before I even read, like,

24
00:01:32.760 --> 00:01:36.000
I read something, but before I ever read it, I'm like,

25
00:01:36.359 --> 00:01:39.480
you know, after listening to music, I'm like, I was

26
00:01:39.519 --> 00:01:41.879
going to ask you when's the movie going come out?

27
00:01:42.239 --> 00:01:46.040
And then I read something that said it's basically.

28
00:01:45.560 --> 00:01:49.000
Like an unnamed movie. So it was like, the music

29
00:01:49.239 --> 00:01:51.319
definitely sends that message.

30
00:01:51.680 --> 00:01:55.239
Yeah, I appreciate it. I think that the main the

31
00:01:55.239 --> 00:01:59.439
main objectives for any record that I have done throughout

32
00:01:59.519 --> 00:02:03.359
my career, and specifically this one is too too as

33
00:02:03.400 --> 00:02:09.080
accurately as as possible described through sound like a period

34
00:02:09.080 --> 00:02:12.319
of time, right, like, yeah, in the past couple of years.

35
00:02:12.360 --> 00:02:14.159
I mean, I don't know what your past couple of

36
00:02:14.240 --> 00:02:17.000
years have been like, but uh, it's been a little.

37
00:02:16.879 --> 00:02:20.240
Chaotic, and it is a bit chaotic in a lot

38
00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:20.719
of ways.

39
00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:25.879
So as a result of that, my typical way of

40
00:02:25.879 --> 00:02:28.879
writing music has always just been like, whatever goes in

41
00:02:29.080 --> 00:02:33.240
is going to come out right, And so having had

42
00:02:33.360 --> 00:02:37.000
such such a chaotic few years, man, it's it's of

43
00:02:37.039 --> 00:02:40.919
no surprise that that the music is as is as

44
00:02:41.000 --> 00:02:45.080
over the top and strange as it is. But again,

45
00:02:45.280 --> 00:02:48.400
the primary objective is to just be as accurate to

46
00:02:48.439 --> 00:02:50.960
the vision as possible. So in that regard, yeah, that's

47
00:02:51.039 --> 00:02:52.960
exactly what it needed to be well.

48
00:02:53.039 --> 00:02:55.319
And to me, music is the best therapy and it's

49
00:02:55.319 --> 00:02:57.800
got to take you on a journey, and I think

50
00:02:57.800 --> 00:02:59.800
we're kind of missing that in a lot of new

51
00:03:00.039 --> 00:03:03.120
music these days because of people's attention span. They make

52
00:03:03.199 --> 00:03:07.800
shorter songs and it's all singles and there's like no

53
00:03:08.039 --> 00:03:10.759
flow to it. That's why I mentioned the Pink Floyd factor,

54
00:03:10.800 --> 00:03:15.199
because like you listen at Darkseide, you go somewhere else, okay,

55
00:03:15.319 --> 00:03:18.759
and you escape all the chaos. And I had that

56
00:03:18.919 --> 00:03:21.800
same feeling listening to your new album. It was like,

57
00:03:22.560 --> 00:03:24.560
I'm just on a journey somewhere.

58
00:03:24.960 --> 00:03:25.159
You know.

59
00:03:25.840 --> 00:03:28.159
Well, we're certainly all on journeys, right, And I think

60
00:03:28.199 --> 00:03:33.800
that the journey for me is it included all this

61
00:03:33.879 --> 00:03:35.599
work that I've done up to this point. And I've

62
00:03:35.599 --> 00:03:39.479
said in a couple interviews so far that there's in

63
00:03:39.520 --> 00:03:42.680
my mind at least a distinct before and after of

64
00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:46.560
the Moth, and moving forward there will be all the

65
00:03:46.599 --> 00:03:49.080
work that I had done prior, like the Strappings and

66
00:03:49.120 --> 00:03:52.719
the Kingdoms and the Zeltoids and all that. And then

67
00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:57.159
there was this weird gray pylon in the road, which

68
00:03:57.280 --> 00:04:01.280
was the moth and then after that it's it's now

69
00:04:01.919 --> 00:04:05.400
in a state of okay, so what's the next phase

70
00:04:05.759 --> 00:04:09.479
for you? And not necessarily even on a musical level,

71
00:04:09.599 --> 00:04:11.919
just like as a person, like where did you land?

72
00:04:12.039 --> 00:04:16.839
Like where are you? And I think that if I

73
00:04:16.879 --> 00:04:20.639
ever had any advice for any musicians that are up

74
00:04:20.639 --> 00:04:24.319
and coming or younger musicians that maybe are looking to

75
00:04:24.439 --> 00:04:27.199
the career that I've had, as you know, what would

76
00:04:27.199 --> 00:04:32.720
you do? It's like you just have to be doggedly

77
00:04:34.279 --> 00:04:39.279
in service of wherever you find yourself. And you know,

78
00:04:39.360 --> 00:04:42.439
these things turn on a dime, like life changes, a

79
00:04:42.439 --> 00:04:45.000
loss of friends and money and all these things that

80
00:04:45.079 --> 00:04:49.000
go into it. It's you can't predict what is going

81
00:04:49.079 --> 00:04:51.600
to happen with your life. But as an artist, I

82
00:04:51.600 --> 00:04:55.360
think that the primary objective is like allowing your creative

83
00:04:55.399 --> 00:04:58.600
catalyst to sort of go and whichever direction that seems

84
00:04:58.639 --> 00:05:03.480
to like I want to go. And you know, I

85
00:05:03.519 --> 00:05:06.199
think for myself over the years, the amount of times

86
00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:08.199
that I've started a project in one place and then

87
00:05:08.399 --> 00:05:12.399
ended in another is like eighty percent. And it's always

88
00:05:12.439 --> 00:05:15.000
been to the chagrin of the record labels and whatever

89
00:05:15.120 --> 00:05:16.639
they're Like you said, this was going to be an

90
00:05:16.639 --> 00:05:19.839
easier record, said this was going to be this, and

91
00:05:19.839 --> 00:05:23.160
I'm like, I know, but the circumstances had something else

92
00:05:23.560 --> 00:05:24.800
in mind, right, So.

93
00:05:25.439 --> 00:05:27.800
I think that's what makes you a true musician, to

94
00:05:27.879 --> 00:05:32.240
be honest, because like I remember when I was playing

95
00:05:32.279 --> 00:05:35.240
guitar as a teenager and I did suck, but my

96
00:05:35.360 --> 00:05:38.879
dad used to say, like, you should give that up.

97
00:05:39.439 --> 00:05:41.360
You don't even know what you're doing. And what I

98
00:05:41.399 --> 00:05:43.399
was doing at the time, I was saying, I was

99
00:05:43.519 --> 00:05:47.120
just like experimenting what sounds I could make it do,

100
00:05:47.399 --> 00:05:48.920
not like copy everybody else.

101
00:05:48.959 --> 00:05:50.240
I just wanted to experiment.

102
00:05:50.759 --> 00:05:53.079
And that's the vibe I got while I was listening

103
00:05:53.079 --> 00:05:56.560
to him, like, oh man, that's something that I think

104
00:05:57.639 --> 00:06:00.279
we need coming back and is starting to come back.

105
00:06:00.399 --> 00:06:04.959
Is that musicianship where you're experimenting and not just doing

106
00:06:05.000 --> 00:06:07.720
some cookie cutter thing to put something out there.

107
00:06:08.360 --> 00:06:11.120
Yeah, it's it's a it's a risk though, you know

108
00:06:11.160 --> 00:06:14.480
what I mean. It is it's like, uh, you know,

109
00:06:14.519 --> 00:06:17.319
specifically when the visions in the scale of those visions

110
00:06:17.360 --> 00:06:19.279
are as large as they tend to be with me,

111
00:06:19.439 --> 00:06:22.519
it's like every time you do something, it costs you everything, right,

112
00:06:23.160 --> 00:06:26.199
and uh, to be willing to sort of put that

113
00:06:26.360 --> 00:06:31.360
sort of attention and focus onto ideas that are really

114
00:06:31.399 --> 00:06:35.920
not commercially viable is always been where my interests lay.

115
00:06:36.439 --> 00:06:38.720
And it's it's it's you know that I've been doing

116
00:06:38.720 --> 00:06:40.560
it for so long now that I'm just like, I

117
00:06:40.680 --> 00:06:42.600
just keep pushing that as far as I can go.

118
00:06:42.800 --> 00:06:46.360
It's it's when somebody had said, you know, what's the

119
00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:48.759
objectives of like what you're doing with your company or

120
00:06:48.800 --> 00:06:51.079
with your record label and all this, I'm like, well,

121
00:06:51.079 --> 00:06:53.600
tell you what it is. It's like, I like putting

122
00:06:53.600 --> 00:06:58.399
together a bunch of brilliant artists who are maybe bored

123
00:06:58.800 --> 00:07:02.360
with their normal jobs and you know whatever. It is

124
00:07:02.399 --> 00:07:04.720
like taking the wrinkles out of Jim Carrey's neck for

125
00:07:05.959 --> 00:07:09.439
number two or whatever, right like, and then see like, well,

126
00:07:09.519 --> 00:07:15.560
let's apply that same kind of ferocious intent onto something

127
00:07:15.600 --> 00:07:20.680
that's just like abstract in nature. And that's always been

128
00:07:22.240 --> 00:07:24.399
where my interests lie. It's like, well, what can we

129
00:07:24.600 --> 00:07:30.120
do that's creative, interesting and fun, that is rooted ultimately

130
00:07:30.160 --> 00:07:34.959
in experimentation. It's it's like it's always been sort of

131
00:07:35.040 --> 00:07:38.439
where my interests lie. And it's in some sense it's

132
00:07:38.439 --> 00:07:41.040
a shame that that my interest never lay in like,

133
00:07:41.120 --> 00:07:42.920
you know, what would be the best pop song that

134
00:07:42.959 --> 00:07:46.120
we could write, or what would be the most would

135
00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:49.600
be the most linear pathway to another heavy metal record.

136
00:07:49.639 --> 00:07:52.600
It's like these things make a lot more sense in

137
00:07:52.680 --> 00:07:55.279
twenty twenty six in the music industry as opposed to

138
00:07:55.360 --> 00:07:59.800
let's just bury everything into this abstract, you know, orchestral

139
00:07:59.800 --> 00:08:04.439
thing about the changing tides of my life personally and

140
00:08:05.160 --> 00:08:07.639
life in general. Dude, it doesn't make any sense to

141
00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:10.319
do something like this, but it's what I want to do.

142
00:08:10.519 --> 00:08:13.720
So that's what we do and until such time that

143
00:08:13.839 --> 00:08:16.759
we can't, And that's just what I do, you know,

144
00:08:16.839 --> 00:08:19.160
And that's what my brand, I guess represents.

145
00:08:19.439 --> 00:08:20.879
I think it should be that way.

146
00:08:20.959 --> 00:08:24.839
I mean, I've always said, like, let the creativity be

147
00:08:25.000 --> 00:08:28.120
for the artists and the business end be for the suits.

148
00:08:29.079 --> 00:08:31.839
And I've been on both sides of the fence. But

149
00:08:31.920 --> 00:08:34.279
I remember back in the eighties. I was in LA

150
00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:37.320
in the eighties and a lot of my friends they

151
00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:40.919
were getting signed and these record labels were telling them

152
00:08:40.919 --> 00:08:43.320
how to change their music and change her look.

153
00:08:43.399 --> 00:08:47.759
And I was like, yeah, no, I'm out. I'm out.

154
00:08:47.840 --> 00:08:49.639
That's why I didn't get good at guitar because I

155
00:08:49.679 --> 00:08:51.759
was like, no, I wouldn't want to do that.

156
00:08:51.799 --> 00:08:53.519
I would want to be true to me, and you're

157
00:08:53.519 --> 00:08:54.240
being true to you.

158
00:08:54.639 --> 00:08:58.000
I am. And I think that the you know, the

159
00:08:58.000 --> 00:09:00.480
practical realities of it are the things that are the

160
00:09:00.519 --> 00:09:02.360
next step for me, because you know, I've got a

161
00:09:02.360 --> 00:09:06.039
staff of people, and we've got mortgage and studio and

162
00:09:06.080 --> 00:09:09.519
all the lights to keep on and all that, and

163
00:09:10.519 --> 00:09:12.159
you you get to a point, I think at a

164
00:09:12.200 --> 00:09:14.679
certain at a certain stage where you have decisions to make.

165
00:09:14.720 --> 00:09:16.840
It's like in order to take certain steps, it's like,

166
00:09:17.360 --> 00:09:19.559
you know, you can be asked to do this, like

167
00:09:19.600 --> 00:09:24.840
whatever it is, like something that maybe compromises what your

168
00:09:24.840 --> 00:09:28.200
intent is or maybe put you back in time doing

169
00:09:28.279 --> 00:09:30.840
things that you've been over for a long time. Regardless

170
00:09:30.840 --> 00:09:34.879
of what it is. Dude, it's like those options become

171
00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:38.679
like like practical considerations. At some point you're just like, okay,

172
00:09:38.679 --> 00:09:40.799
we can't continue like this, so do we do this

173
00:09:41.600 --> 00:09:48.320
or whatever? And at that point, my whole reason to

174
00:09:48.360 --> 00:09:51.240
be has been sort of contingent on that moment. But

175
00:09:51.279 --> 00:09:55.559
it just keeps moving forward. You know. It's like it's

176
00:09:55.600 --> 00:09:57.080
like I'm just like, Okay, I'm going to do this,

177
00:09:57.240 --> 00:09:59.039
and by doing this, I'm never going to be able

178
00:09:59.039 --> 00:10:01.279
to do this again. So there's been the amount of

179
00:10:01.320 --> 00:10:03.399
times that I've chosen to go that route, whether it

180
00:10:03.440 --> 00:10:06.559
was strapping back in the day or ziltoid or EmPATH

181
00:10:06.720 --> 00:10:10.200
or dream piece or whatever, that frame of mind has

182
00:10:10.240 --> 00:10:12.799
been like a big part of my trip. And every

183
00:10:12.799 --> 00:10:15.519
time I do that, I'm like, Okay, damn the torpedoes,

184
00:10:15.600 --> 00:10:17.519
let's do this, and then by this time next year

185
00:10:17.519 --> 00:10:20.440
we'll probably be broken. We'll have to like quit. So

186
00:10:20.519 --> 00:10:23.519
that's but you know, it's been thirty eight years of that, and.

187
00:10:23.480 --> 00:10:24.960
So you're still here.

188
00:10:25.159 --> 00:10:28.519
So the only thing that is also still here that

189
00:10:28.600 --> 00:10:31.039
I would like to see go away is that constant

190
00:10:31.120 --> 00:10:35.600
sort of amber alert anxiety feeling of like, yeah, the

191
00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:38.639
ass is going to fall out of everything, right. But

192
00:10:38.759 --> 00:10:40.759
I will say that I'm not alone with that feeling.

193
00:10:40.840 --> 00:10:42.799
I'm sure most of us feel that at this point.

194
00:10:42.919 --> 00:10:47.759
So I think that for me, the decisions to make

195
00:10:47.840 --> 00:10:50.600
these things that are rooted much more and like you know,

196
00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:57.080
frankly sort of selfish artistic musings. I figure, Man, if

197
00:10:57.080 --> 00:10:58.960
we're going to have to do this anyway, I might

198
00:10:58.960 --> 00:11:00.720
as well just do the things that I want to do,

199
00:11:01.159 --> 00:11:05.639
as you know, utilizing all this stuff to just essentially

200
00:11:05.720 --> 00:11:07.399
have a day job that I don't care.

201
00:11:07.240 --> 00:11:11.240
About, right yeah, And I mean that's why I say,

202
00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:12.879
if you're going to be an artist, you might as

203
00:11:12.879 --> 00:11:15.600
well be true yourself and and then you're going to

204
00:11:15.679 --> 00:11:18.759
attract your tribe. You know, you're going to attract the

205
00:11:18.840 --> 00:11:23.639
people that appreciate and understand or get something out of

206
00:11:23.639 --> 00:11:24.759
what you're doing.

207
00:11:24.879 --> 00:11:26.720
That's the hope. And I and I would much rather

208
00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:31.039
have a smaller, uh group of those than than you know,

209
00:11:31.039 --> 00:11:33.039
a larger group of people that I'm beholden to for

210
00:11:33.120 --> 00:11:36.440
things that I no longer am interested in, right So so,

211
00:11:36.559 --> 00:11:39.919
but I mean, do these shade these choices are are

212
00:11:40.000 --> 00:11:42.960
ones that are not ones to be taken lightly. And

213
00:11:42.960 --> 00:11:47.240
and also they're not ones that that happens so far

214
00:11:47.519 --> 00:11:51.159
under the surface that you're not aware of them. Right Like, Like,

215
00:11:51.240 --> 00:11:55.440
whenever I've made a decision to go and in in

216
00:11:55.600 --> 00:12:00.679
uh in a direction that's like you know, fiercely non

217
00:12:01.600 --> 00:12:07.919
you know, friendly, it hasn't been one that I was

218
00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:10.200
an accident. It was like, okay, you can do this

219
00:12:10.279 --> 00:12:13.639
if this is what your choice is. And I've chosen

220
00:12:13.679 --> 00:12:17.159
to do that consistently but no more so than I

221
00:12:17.200 --> 00:12:19.840
have with Moth, almost to draw a line in the sand.

222
00:12:20.679 --> 00:12:24.279
It's almost like, you know, if by doing this industry

223
00:12:24.279 --> 00:12:28.440
at large, it's like, yeah, it's not for us, it's

224
00:12:28.480 --> 00:12:32.000
not for any part of the industry, including your demographic

225
00:12:32.159 --> 00:12:35.720
Right at that point, I know that the decision I

226
00:12:35.720 --> 00:12:37.879
need to make moving forward is like, Okay, well do

227
00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:41.120
you still want to do this, because it's like, well,

228
00:12:41.159 --> 00:12:43.519
this won't work. But if you go back to i

229
00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:47.240
don't know, like playing metal full time in your mid

230
00:12:47.279 --> 00:12:50.399
fifties or whatever, then you can kind of sustain this.

231
00:12:50.519 --> 00:12:51.840
There's a part of it. It's just like, oh, well

232
00:12:51.840 --> 00:12:55.399
there's my decision. Then yeah, you know, but I think

233
00:12:55.440 --> 00:12:57.039
that the only way you're going to be able to

234
00:12:57.080 --> 00:12:59.399
make a decision like that is to sort of damn

235
00:12:59.440 --> 00:13:00.320
the torpedo.

236
00:13:00.159 --> 00:13:03.000
And do it. Yeah, no risk, no reward.

237
00:13:03.279 --> 00:13:05.919
Well this is it. So basically I built a facility

238
00:13:06.039 --> 00:13:08.840
and did the Moth and did Ruby Quaker and did

239
00:13:08.879 --> 00:13:13.919
all these things. Not because it's a wise business move,

240
00:13:14.080 --> 00:13:16.879
not because this is like some financial plan that I'm

241
00:13:17.039 --> 00:13:18.759
you know, like by doing A to B two C.

242
00:13:19.000 --> 00:13:20.679
At the end of it, you don't have to work anymore.

243
00:13:20.720 --> 00:13:23.799
It's like none of that plays into it. I'm just like,

244
00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:27.519
I'm like, the only things that interest me when it

245
00:13:27.559 --> 00:13:30.080
comes to being a musician now are things like dream,

246
00:13:30.120 --> 00:13:32.720
peace or moth or any of this abstract stuff. Right.

247
00:13:33.879 --> 00:13:35.840
So I'm gonna do that with my full heart. And

248
00:13:36.039 --> 00:13:41.799
if I'm meant to sustain a life as a professional musician,

249
00:13:43.480 --> 00:13:47.480
then I'll know. And if I'm not, if it's like, no,

250
00:13:47.559 --> 00:13:50.200
I didn't work, You're gonna have to scramble to try

251
00:13:50.240 --> 00:13:52.440
and keep this going. I'm like, I'd rather not to

252
00:13:52.480 --> 00:13:55.200
be honest, I don't blame it. Yeah, I'd rather have

253
00:13:55.240 --> 00:13:57.600
a life that was like completely separate from this, like

254
00:13:57.720 --> 00:14:01.480
nuke all of this and then just like say okay,

255
00:14:01.519 --> 00:14:03.799
so and so the line in the sand for me

256
00:14:03.960 --> 00:14:06.559
with the Moth was like it's either I do this

257
00:14:07.480 --> 00:14:11.360
like this with this studio or I don't do it

258
00:14:11.399 --> 00:14:14.960
at all. Yeah, And it's like, uh, you know, because

259
00:14:14.960 --> 00:14:16.279
the others saying it's like, oh, will you do this

260
00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:17.840
and you bring your costs down, you do this, and

261
00:14:17.840 --> 00:14:19.240
then you go to the studio and you can do

262
00:14:19.279 --> 00:14:21.399
it like put make sure that you focus on the

263
00:14:21.480 --> 00:14:24.120
chorus or you know, make sure you're screaming more and

264
00:14:24.159 --> 00:14:25.480
I'm just like, dude, I don't want to do that.

265
00:14:25.720 --> 00:14:28.720
I just don't want to do it. So and what

266
00:14:28.759 --> 00:14:31.159
would I rather do, dide, I'd rather do yard work.

267
00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:35.440
I'd rather garden, I'd rather you know, like I'd rather

268
00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:38.879
focus on mental health or my nutrition or things like that.

269
00:14:39.320 --> 00:14:44.120
Those are things that I would prefer to do then

270
00:14:44.240 --> 00:14:48.519
struggle to maintain a studio only to do music that

271
00:14:48.559 --> 00:14:51.720
I'm no longer interested in. So the again, the line

272
00:14:51.720 --> 00:14:53.559
in the Sand for the Moth and dream Piece and

273
00:14:53.639 --> 00:14:56.559
Ruby Quaker was just like, I'm putting everything into this

274
00:14:57.440 --> 00:15:00.679
not because I'm hoping that it will succeed, just because

275
00:15:00.879 --> 00:15:03.600
if it doesn't, then it's way more efficient for me

276
00:15:03.679 --> 00:15:03.960
to know.

277
00:15:04.720 --> 00:15:09.000
Yeah, and you know, speaking of you know, mental health,

278
00:15:09.039 --> 00:15:11.840
I mean if you're not if you're an artist, especially,

279
00:15:11.879 --> 00:15:15.879
I think if you're not creating the music that is

280
00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:20.240
you and your part of your soul, that is not

281
00:15:20.440 --> 00:15:21.759
good for your mental health.

282
00:15:21.840 --> 00:15:24.639
It is not good for your mental or physical health

283
00:15:24.720 --> 00:15:31.879
because you're constantly chasing the approval of people who expect

284
00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:34.840
you to be something that you're not. So you're an

285
00:15:34.919 --> 00:15:38.720
actor all of a sudden, and it's like, you know,

286
00:15:38.919 --> 00:15:41.480
for me, I'm just like I have no desire to

287
00:15:41.480 --> 00:15:44.559
do that, like, and it's not there's no flippancy to that,

288
00:15:44.600 --> 00:15:47.840
there's no anger to it. It's just like, Okay, at

289
00:15:47.840 --> 00:15:50.360
this age, what do you want to do? And so

290
00:15:50.519 --> 00:15:53.919
basically I was like, when the Moth came up, and

291
00:15:53.960 --> 00:15:56.879
when the idea of like you know, building a studio

292
00:15:56.960 --> 00:16:00.120
or whatever came up, anybody in my world managed and

293
00:16:00.320 --> 00:16:03.440
financially record labels just like, I don't know if that's

294
00:16:03.480 --> 00:16:06.240
the best thing to do. And I'm like, well, I'm

295
00:16:06.240 --> 00:16:10.279
gonna do it, and then at the end of it, I'll.

296
00:16:10.039 --> 00:16:13.320
Know, Yeah, you don't know if you don't try. If

297
00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:14.879
you don't try, you don't know anyway.

298
00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:17.039
So what I've done, this is what I've done. And

299
00:16:17.080 --> 00:16:21.679
so you know, this record gets released tomorrow, and you know,

300
00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:26.000
if everybody collectively is just like eh, then I'm like, okay, great,

301
00:16:26.039 --> 00:16:28.000
So what's my next step in the year. What's my

302
00:16:28.039 --> 00:16:30.440
next step in the year? Because when people are coming

303
00:16:30.440 --> 00:16:32.320
back going, you know, you can continue to do things

304
00:16:32.320 --> 00:16:33.799
like the Moth if you go out and you do

305
00:16:33.879 --> 00:16:36.279
this and you you know, you do the you know,

306
00:16:37.759 --> 00:16:41.759
you know all this sort of thing, and I'm just like, yeah,

307
00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:44.440
but I don't want to I do. I'm cool with

308
00:16:44.480 --> 00:16:46.840
doing things like the Moth. I'm cool with doing things

309
00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:49.240
like dream Peace. I'm cool with doing things like Puzzle.

310
00:16:49.320 --> 00:16:52.159
I'm cool with doing things like Axe Lotel or any

311
00:16:52.159 --> 00:16:54.639
of these. Like, you know, I'm working on this crazy

312
00:16:54.759 --> 00:16:58.919
like plug in product called the Seeker that's like interesting

313
00:16:59.000 --> 00:17:02.200
to me. And even that, it's like I remember bringing

314
00:17:02.240 --> 00:17:05.000
this this pedal plugin thing to the people that are

315
00:17:05.000 --> 00:17:07.640
going to be building it for us, right, and they're like,

316
00:17:08.599 --> 00:17:10.799
they're like, it's going to cost a fortune to do this,

317
00:17:11.200 --> 00:17:14.559
and it's a super fucking weird product. You know, if

318
00:17:14.559 --> 00:17:16.720
you want to make money, why don't you do like

319
00:17:16.799 --> 00:17:19.599
a you know, a version of an eight oh eight

320
00:17:19.839 --> 00:17:22.759
distortion pedal with like just a slightly different tone stack

321
00:17:22.799 --> 00:17:25.319
in it. I'm like, cause it's fucking boring, dude, Like

322
00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:29.119
I just don't care. There's like forty of those available

323
00:17:29.200 --> 00:17:31.400
now that I don't have to invest in. Like, yeah,

324
00:17:31.440 --> 00:17:35.279
but you can keep a sustainable enterprise going if you

325
00:17:35.319 --> 00:17:36.720
do that, And I'm like, yeah, but I just that's

326
00:17:36.759 --> 00:17:39.279
not what I want to do. It's like I don't

327
00:17:39.319 --> 00:17:41.880
want to make pedals. I don't want to make overdrive pedals,

328
00:17:41.880 --> 00:17:45.079
but I do want to make this secret thing. It's

329
00:17:45.160 --> 00:17:48.319
super interesting to me. The same thing people are going, well,

330
00:17:48.319 --> 00:17:49.759
you know, if you go back out and you play

331
00:17:49.799 --> 00:17:52.319
metal and you go out and you do this sort

332
00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:54.119
of thing with a full band and all this stuff,

333
00:17:54.160 --> 00:17:55.960
you can kind of get those tours and keep going.

334
00:17:56.000 --> 00:18:00.759
I'm like, yeah, I don't want to do that, though, Like.

335
00:18:00.000 --> 00:18:03.880
I should say that part too, because I have this

336
00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:07.799
memory from a couple of years ago that I absolutely

337
00:18:07.880 --> 00:18:10.440
love your brutal honesty. I'm like originally from New York

338
00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:14.200
and New Jersey, so I like brutal honesty. Okay, And

339
00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:19.119
you were doing the press conference at Hellfest and you

340
00:18:19.160 --> 00:18:24.599
were talking about touring and how like not the glorifying

341
00:18:24.720 --> 00:18:27.799
of it, but the exact opposite. And it was so

342
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:31.079
funny because like I go and I do radio coverage

343
00:18:31.079 --> 00:18:34.640
at festivals all over the US, UK, Europe, and like

344
00:18:34.759 --> 00:18:36.720
last year, I only even think I had a weekend.

345
00:18:36.759 --> 00:18:39.720
I wasn't at a festival with so much and people

346
00:18:39.759 --> 00:18:42.079
are like, oh, you're living a dream life. And part

347
00:18:42.119 --> 00:18:45.519
of that's true, yeah, but they don't see the other

348
00:18:45.680 --> 00:18:47.799
part of it, like you talked about in the press

349
00:18:47.880 --> 00:18:51.119
conference of like literally it's shit.

350
00:18:51.319 --> 00:18:53.599
Sometimes it's like.

351
00:18:53.960 --> 00:18:56.319
Taking a dump and a bag on a thirty five

352
00:18:56.440 --> 00:18:59.680
degree day with Watain playing in the background at a

353
00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:02.680
fucking one hundred and forty dB at twelve in the afternoon.

354
00:19:02.720 --> 00:19:04.880
You know what I mean, You're just like you're like,

355
00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:11.119
you know, like dude. But but again, this is where

356
00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:15.680
it's interesting to me because the projects like the Moth

357
00:19:15.799 --> 00:19:18.599
or the project Dreampece are puzzle or seeker, any of

358
00:19:18.599 --> 00:19:21.640
these things that I'm currently doing, I'm interested in. They're fun.

359
00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:27.119
So it's not like, although, like anything, there's certain aspects

360
00:19:27.160 --> 00:19:31.799
of it that are struggle and require you know, tenacity

361
00:19:31.880 --> 00:19:35.440
and diligence and whatever. Overall the things that I'm able

362
00:19:35.480 --> 00:19:38.440
to do right now, I'm really like like psychedon, Like

363
00:19:38.480 --> 00:19:39.079
it's fun for.

364
00:19:39.039 --> 00:19:39.680
You see that.

365
00:19:39.680 --> 00:19:41.799
That's the way it has to be in my opinion,

366
00:19:42.000 --> 00:19:44.119
Like I say it all the time, if you're going

367
00:19:44.200 --> 00:19:47.640
to be in the music business, you better have that

368
00:19:47.720 --> 00:19:50.480
because otherwise everything else sucks, so you might as well

369
00:19:50.599 --> 00:19:51.880
just go do something else.

370
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:54.000
So that's what I'm saying. So we're gonna find out

371
00:19:54.000 --> 00:19:57.039
what the Moth right like if it's if people are

372
00:19:57.079 --> 00:19:59.160
just like, yeah, don't give a fuck about this, and

373
00:19:59.319 --> 00:20:02.119
you know, right, so why should they it's not important.

374
00:20:02.160 --> 00:20:03.880
It's just the next thing that I did right. But

375
00:20:04.599 --> 00:20:07.759
if people don't like it, then dude, I know where

376
00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:10.279
I'm at because I'm like, well, it's not getting any

377
00:20:10.359 --> 00:20:15.359
more linear than this. I guarantee you, you know, moving forward, Man,

378
00:20:15.400 --> 00:20:19.079
it's not gonna there's it's not gonna go more. This

379
00:20:19.119 --> 00:20:21.160
is just a three and a half minute song about

380
00:20:21.160 --> 00:20:23.279
how I've loved and lost and learned my lesson or

381
00:20:23.279 --> 00:20:25.359
any of that shit. I'm just guy like, no, man,

382
00:20:25.480 --> 00:20:29.359
I just it's either I make weird ass motherfucking shit

383
00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:32.319
and do it with a group of people who are

384
00:20:32.359 --> 00:20:36.880
incredibly creative, brilliant people and we enjoy the process because

385
00:20:36.920 --> 00:20:39.200
it's things that are left to center, or I find

386
00:20:39.240 --> 00:20:41.319
another thing to do right and I'm cool with that.

387
00:20:41.400 --> 00:20:44.079
And this is the uh, this is the line in

388
00:20:44.119 --> 00:20:48.799
the sand and I I and either way, I just

389
00:20:48.839 --> 00:20:52.200
want to know it's there's no there's no like, oh

390
00:20:52.319 --> 00:20:55.000
that's a shame or or oh that's surprising. I'm just

391
00:20:55.079 --> 00:20:56.640
kind of like, Okay, good, where are we at. I

392
00:20:56.640 --> 00:20:58.839
don't want to waste any more time. This is what

393
00:20:58.920 --> 00:21:02.720
I do. This is who I You like it? No, okay, great? Thanks?

394
00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:04.480
Well when I was listening to it.

395
00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:07.839
I was thinking myself, oh man, he could do like

396
00:21:07.920 --> 00:21:11.119
Danny Effman's doing and do some like Marvel movies or

397
00:21:11.240 --> 00:21:12.240
DC movies or.

398
00:21:12.240 --> 00:21:15.599
Something play well with others. Though when it comes to

399
00:21:15.599 --> 00:21:16.160
that shit.

400
00:21:16.039 --> 00:21:17.680
I don't even mean you doing them.

401
00:21:17.720 --> 00:21:21.160
I mean just this music like it could apply to

402
00:21:21.200 --> 00:21:25.119
something like that, you know, or it just has that

403
00:21:25.240 --> 00:21:29.920
whole like I just was sitting, I was taking a

404
00:21:29.960 --> 00:21:32.160
long drive and just listened to the whole thing and

405
00:21:32.519 --> 00:21:35.079
I couldn't even tell where the song separated. A lot

406
00:21:35.119 --> 00:21:39.759
of times with That's the killer about a whole album

407
00:21:39.839 --> 00:21:43.720
that's like that, because it's like you are doing so

408
00:21:43.960 --> 00:21:47.039
good that you don't even know that you're a different song.

409
00:21:47.519 --> 00:21:51.000
That means you've escaped your reality. And that's what music

410
00:21:51.039 --> 00:21:51.480
should do.

411
00:21:52.200 --> 00:21:56.319
Yeah, I think you you escape it by by confronting it.

412
00:21:56.400 --> 00:21:59.680
You know, the reality, and you know the more that

413
00:21:59.720 --> 00:22:04.519
I have spent time with this project and with this

414
00:22:04.599 --> 00:22:07.799
frame of mind, right, the frame of mind being specifically

415
00:22:08.839 --> 00:22:14.559
I care about the audience, but my objectives are moving forward.

416
00:22:15.559 --> 00:22:17.799
I don't want to do this unless I'm doing something

417
00:22:17.839 --> 00:22:22.759
that interests me. Yeah, And the distinction between doing music

418
00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:26.559
that interests me in music that doesn't interest me, or

419
00:22:26.680 --> 00:22:31.119
is whether or not it applies to my current reality. Otherwise, dude,

420
00:22:31.119 --> 00:22:35.319
you're not singing from any point reference point of authority.

421
00:22:35.799 --> 00:22:38.160
You're just you're acting again, You're making it up. You're like,

422
00:22:38.559 --> 00:22:41.960
what would somebody who thinks like this write? And it's like,

423
00:22:43.160 --> 00:22:46.960
you know, the people who really follow the career, whether

424
00:22:47.039 --> 00:22:49.799
or not they like where I've landed, they're gonna know

425
00:22:49.960 --> 00:22:51.640
immediately they're like always full of shit.

426
00:22:52.839 --> 00:22:55.960
Well, yeah, it's funny you should say that because, like

427
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:58.240
somebody have interviewed a few times, so I'm friendly with

428
00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:02.400
Joe from the he knows I won't ask a certain

429
00:23:02.480 --> 00:23:05.799
question that everybody else asks. So when are the Vandals

430
00:23:05.799 --> 00:23:08.279
gonna have new music? He said, he'll do like in

431
00:23:08.279 --> 00:23:09.960
the interview with me because he knows I won't ask.

432
00:23:10.039 --> 00:23:12.559
He goes, and don't ask me when the Vandals are

433
00:23:12.559 --> 00:23:15.000
gonna have new music, because nobody wants to see a

434
00:23:15.039 --> 00:23:18.000
fifty something year old right punk rock music.

435
00:23:19.160 --> 00:23:21.480
Or play industrial thrash metal. I mean, I think it's

436
00:23:21.599 --> 00:23:27.440
like now and I've got to go to this next interview. Yes,

437
00:23:27.039 --> 00:23:31.400
but now is really the point, not only in my

438
00:23:32.119 --> 00:23:35.559
professional history, but I almost think just the world at large,

439
00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:40.240
where we've had this opportunity to be thrust into a

440
00:23:40.359 --> 00:23:44.839
reflective state on our own lives, on what the where

441
00:23:44.839 --> 00:23:47.599
we place value, what has value at this point, whether

442
00:23:47.599 --> 00:23:49.400
it was friends and family, or if it's work, or

443
00:23:49.400 --> 00:23:52.039
if it's money or whatever it is. I think that

444
00:23:52.160 --> 00:23:55.680
as a society, we've we've had the veil sort of

445
00:23:55.720 --> 00:23:58.440
removed from these things that we had ascribed value to

446
00:23:58.559 --> 00:24:01.160
for so long. You know, like any question it's like, oh,

447
00:24:01.200 --> 00:24:04.920
you become famous, or you go to university for to

448
00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:07.359
be a doctor or whatever, and then all of a sudden,

449
00:24:07.400 --> 00:24:09.880
those things no longer hold the same kind of like

450
00:24:10.599 --> 00:24:16.960
confirmed social uh collateral that they once did. You're just like,

451
00:24:17.200 --> 00:24:20.880
oh shit, okay, so left with this as like an

452
00:24:20.960 --> 00:24:25.839
actual option. Who are you? What do you want to do?

453
00:24:26.519 --> 00:24:32.079
And I'm so grateful for being posed that question in

454
00:24:32.119 --> 00:24:34.440
my own life. Would I like to be able to

455
00:24:34.519 --> 00:24:37.799
continue doing what I do with the group of people

456
00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:41.400
that I have in this place that I've you know,

457
00:24:41.720 --> 00:24:46.400
built to do it? Hell yeah, but I don't want

458
00:24:46.440 --> 00:24:48.640
to do it. If I have to do something that

459
00:24:48.640 --> 00:24:49.960
I'm not interested.

460
00:24:49.519 --> 00:24:51.559
In, well I think it will happen.

461
00:24:51.920 --> 00:24:56.599
Because the moth is badass just saying everybody's gotta check

462
00:24:56.640 --> 00:24:59.759
it out. And I thank you for like making this

463
00:25:00.359 --> 00:25:06.440
creative project that I think is just absolute pure musicianship.

464
00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:09.920
You brother, and thanks for being on the Adventures of Pipemin.

465
00:25:10.359 --> 00:25:12.599
We'll talk to you soon and thanks again. Hey, this

466
00:25:12.680 --> 00:25:14.920
is Devin Townsend and you are currently listening to the

467
00:25:14.960 --> 00:25:18.200
Pipe Main on W four c Y Radio. Thank you

468
00:25:18.359 --> 00:25:24.039
for listening to the Adventures of Pipemin on W for

469
00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:25.960
CUI Radio.